[zmpdoris]

Dear All

Need some advice! Been offered a 2003 Ford Focus Ghia 1.8 for £3800 but it is a Cat D. Hasn't been in a accident but it was vandalised, and had a new front windowscreen replaced, new o/s front wing, a repair to both o/s doors and two new tyres (the original's were slashed). Is this a good buy? The car only has 40,000 miles and the job done on the car seems very good.

Also do I declare this to my Insurance Company?

Any advice most appreicated!

[HPI Check]

A cat write off is normally worth about 50% of the market value, you must decalare this to your insurance and i would strongly advise getting it checked out for safety before you buy, the RAC vehicle inspections team could do this if you do not know a competent machanic

[SID1987]

Category D- advice

Hi I'm looking to buy a ford focus lx 1.8 tdci, its a 53 plate with 86k on the clock, the car is in good condition, and also comes with St 170 alloys which is in excellent condition, unfortunatly the car is a cat D, the alloys and system on the car was stolen, so it was registered as a cat D, ive taken the car for a test drive, and drives perfectly well, also comes with full service history mot and tax. ive checked on the autotrader and have seen normal focus diesel cars that are not category D cars sell for well over £3,500 to over 4 grand, and this is with the mileage high of upto 100,000 on the clock, the guy is asking for £3,350 is that too much? What should i offer him?
HELP PLEASE! ADVICE NEEDED

[Poddy]

Dont have a clue zmp, but if RAC autwindscreens did the front glass i know that'd be a good job as ive recently started an apprentiship with them and i see what a great job they do on the glass :o

[HPI Check]

It seems very little work to have the car written off on such a new plate, i would get it checked out carefully!!! See if you can find out when it was written off and speak to the owner at the time.

It May also be worth getting an RAC vehicle inspection and as always make sure the Cat D is correct through an RAC check. As for value, by rule of thumb a cat write of is normally worth around 50% of a non cat vehicle, therefore this does seem quite high. Don't be fooled by nice alloys, you can buy a non cat D car for about the same, put a nice set of alloys on it for not much money and have no trouble insuring or selling it at a later date

[CatCars]

Originally Posted by HPI Check

It seems very little work to have the car written off on such a new plate, i would get it checked out carefully!!! See if you can find out when it was written off and speak to the owner at the time.

It May also be worth getting an RAC vehicle inspection and as always make sure the Cat D is correct through an RAC check. As for value, by rule of thumb a cat write of is normally worth around 50% of a non cat vehicle, therefore this does seem quite high. Don't be fooled by nice alloys, you can buy a non cat D car for about the same, put a nice set of alloys on it for not much money and have no trouble insuring or selling it at a later date

Of course a category C or D car can have very little damage.
It's all about money? A desirable model car will have a very high salvage value, insurance companies no longer rely on percentage of the p.a.v. to assess a salvage value, they look what previous salvage vehicles of the same type have made at their online auctions and take this into account when deciding which is the way they lose the least amount of money.

Its just HPI doing a bit of scare mongering, After all they have a monopoly on this area.

[ParkerM]

I have been tempted to buy Cat D cars in the past as like its previously been mention they are normaly dirt cheap compared to what they would cost.
I just never went ahead and bought one as I didn't like the fact its been a right-off and who knows how well its been fixed. I always thought that the insurance would be so much more as well when insuring a Cat-D, as surely they won't give you the same price as a car that's not been in a right-off.

[Rolebama]

My last two cars were Cat C, and there was no loading whatsoever, nor were repairs ever carried out. Superficial damage only, but cost of repairs beyond value of car.

[CatCars]

A vehicle given a Category A B C or D does not mean the "car" is a 'write off' or 'total loss' and insurance companies do not MAKE a vehicle a write off or total loss. You could not even say that category A vehicles are a write off as some undamaged vehicles can be placed into category A.
Insurance companies often refer to vehicles involved in an accident as a 'write off' or 'total loss', which gives the wrong impression to anyone not familiar with the insurance or salvage industry. An insurance company faced with a claim first estimates the financial cost of repairing the vehicle to its pre-accident condition.
If the financial cost to the insurance company is the same or near to the market price, the insurance company would normally call this vehicle a write off which means that they will 'write off' the financial cost of the repair, not the vehicle itself.
The term total loss is also often misused. It actually means the insurance company made a complete financial loss, i.e. they recovered no money from the sale of the salvage and therefore made a total financial loss on the claim.

The category C or D given to a vehicle is mainly determined by the cost of repairs in relation the vehicles age and value. A Cat C vehicle can have less damage than a vehicle with a Cat D listing.

Identical cars A and B both have identical damage. Car A was in London while car B was in Stockport. It cost £900 more to fix car A that car B because of the storage charges in London. It so happens that they are both with the same insurance company (not that it really matters).
The same Loss Adjuster decides not to have car A repaired (so car A automatically gets a category C) as the repair cost for car A are £400 above his maximum for that cars year and model however he will get car B repaired.

So car B gets repaired and is not shown on any database and the owner certainly will never tell a future buyer that fact and even if he did the car is NOT on any database as a category car.

Car A however is bought from the insurance company by the registered workshop (not that it really matters) that repaired car B. They repair car A to the same standard BUT car A is now on the HPI register as a category C and no matter how many engineers inspect and pass the car it cannot be removed from HPI's database. Even if (after a £300 test) HPI categorised the car as Condition inspected the car is still category C.

There is a good argument that ALL cars that are damaged should be given a category listing that stays with the car even after repair !
Then watch insurance premiums go through the roof.

[CatCars]

Originally Posted by ParkerM

I have been tempted to buy Cat D cars in the past as like its previously been mention they are normaly dirt cheap compared to what they would cost.
I just never went ahead and bought one as I didn't like the fact its been a right-off and who knows how well its been fixed. I always thought that the insurance would be so much more as well when insuring a Cat-D, as surely they won't give you the same price as a car that's not been in a right-off.

The question of whether they have been repaired correctly is a separate issue as ANY vehicle that is not looked after, serviced correctly, or repaired correctly is most probably not safe or roadworthy. Any vehicle bought from a private individual or even a dealership that is not inspected means you really don't know if it is safe or roadworthy.
You could argue that if a vehicle is sold as a category C or D then you are being informed of its history and can make better informed choice as opposed to the thousands of vehicles that have a hidden history because they have been repaired by the insurance companies.
Insurance companies keep the cost of premiums down by selling the cars they will not repair to the trade who can repair them more cost effectively. If they repaired a car then loaded the premium OR loaded the premium on cars repaired with a category C or D listing no one would take back their repaired car OR buy a cat car SO ALL insurance premiums would go through the roof. They would be cutting off their own foot.

[Rolebama]

CatCars, i am curious. Under what circumstances would a non-damaged car be written off as a Cat A?

[CatCars]

Originally Posted by Rolebama

CatCars, i am curious. Under what circumstances would a non-damaged car be written off as a Cat A?

Certain Gov organisations can order a vehicle to be sent to a Authorised Treatment Facility (ATF) who must issue a Certificate of Destruction (CoD) for that vehicle no mater what condition the vehicle is in and no parts can be sold (cat A).
The police can order a vehicle (no mater what condition / age) to be sent to a ATF but parts can be sold (cat B).

PS are you really a Formula One driver?

[Mike Gray]

Originally Posted by CatCars

PS are you really a Formula One driver?

That's just the forum's ranking system...

[CatCars]

Originally Posted by Mike Gray

That's just the forum's ranking system...

I know

[Rolebama]

CatCars, that doesn't answer my question. Any car can be scrapped by the owner and get a Certificate of Destruction, but I don't see how that gets a Cat A, as V5 is returned to DVLA with no insurance company involvement. I feel I am missing something here?

No, I am not, nor ever have been a Formula One Driver, and have never raced a car on a track. I used to race motorcycles, and won a few bits and bobs over the years. I also won a few Trials Events in my time too.